Ben Tatar and the Tatar Tots
In this interview, Ben Tatar discusses the creative fusion of kid-friendly rock and jazz, family influences, musical education, and the playful inspiration behind The Tatar Tots’ latest album, The Kids’ Table.
1. Your music combines kid-friendly rock with plenty of jazz elements, including improvisation, lively horn arrangements, and trombone solos. What inspired you to create this particular musical identity, and how did the idea of bringing rock and jazz together for young listeners develop?
I suppose this music is somehow the sum of many parts added over the years; this is what happens when teaching general music in the public schools for 22 years combines with a personal playlist that has included Steely Dan, Phish, Frank Zappa and Talking Heads. (And some modern jazz, like Vince Mendoza, Maria Schneider and Darcy James Argue…. but most people probably don’t know them. I suppose a hallmark of getting older as an artist might be (in some avenues) to gather all that you have collected over the years and pour it into your work, whatever it is. I don’t think I ever thought, growing up, that I’d be my own horn section in my own trombone-focused rock band geared towards kids, but every decision I have made in my life has led me here! I think the fusion of kids music with all of these elements is also a part of my belief that music for kids shouldn’t be dumbed down! I think I am constantly inspired by the opportunity to make a mark, creatively, in a way that has rarely been done.
2. Your third album, The Kids’ Table, continues your delicious tradition of writing songs about food. What keeps this theme so creatively inspiring, and how do you find new ways to turn everyday foods and eating experiences into entertaining musical stories?
I think a great musical challenge for me is to not bore the listener, regardless of their age….. not easy to do when both the young child and tired grown up might be sitting in on the same listen! I strive to make the songs exciting in some way, whether it’s borrowing different musical styles (we’ve done rhumbas, waltzes, New Orleans 2nd lines, a capella songs, funk jams, big band, etc…) and never make them similar. For the songwriting process, I open up a huge brainstorming session on all terms, puns, phrases and possibilities connected to each food to bring each listener’s ear something they can hang on to, even if they don’t like the food we’re singing about. But these songs can’t simply be love songs to these foods, one after the next: “I love pizza” “I love pancakes” “I love chocolate milk.” We’d bore our listener, especially the grownup who controls the skip button.
I also feel like as I am evolving with my theme which I’ve committed to, that the actual food can start to take the “backseat” to other themes. On “The Kids’ Table,” we use “Pictures of Food” as a way of exploring suspicion (in a light and humorous way), and “The Breakfast Song” from our 2nd album reflects on the morning love shown by parents as we start the day. Our title track for the 3rd album, also the opening song of the album, uses people gathering at a table without me as a way of demonstrating a familiar FOMO feeling. So, I can’t just be singing about how much I love a food…. I feel a need to make them either more literary or to function as an activity. (segue to your next question!….)
3. Several songs on the album, including “Pass It On Down The Line” and “The Candy Dance,” encourage children to participate through dancing, call-and-response, and improvisation. How important is audience interaction to your songwriting, and do the reactions of children ever inspire new musical ideas?
GET. THEM. MOVING! Many songs on “The Kids’ Table” focus on not just being songs, but activities or vehicles for explorations in movement. Once the title track is over and we’ve found a spot at the kids’ table…. it’s time to get up and just JUMP with “Jumping Beans.” I don’t want to have songs that are too deliberate and correspondingly dumbed down, but add our food theme and a bit of nonsense lyrics, and now we’re UP!
“Pass It On Down The Line,” (also known as “The Hot Dog Song” at our live shows) functions as a progressive dance where we add a topping to the hot dog each verse, but also include all of the previous toppings each time. Speaking of reactions of the children, I will often ask the audience for their topping requests — and usually go with WHATEVER they want! We are always prepared for the ketchup crowd, but sometimes I call out “onions” for my own preference and tell kids if they don’t like onions, “they can go cry about it.” We may also use some of the leftover chopped onions (chopped, of course, as a part of a dance move) when we make our pizza during “Thinking of Pizza” and REALLY get our imaginations going.
“The Candy Dance” usually involves calling up several volunteers (usually the kids, but I love getting a grown-up on stage!) who lead the audience in a spontaneous dance in the name of their favorite candy (sung each time the refrain comes up). Who cares that it’s a 3 chord song?! This song could last 15 minutes if we wanted, or if we had lots of willing dance leaders.
“All The Cooks In The Kitchen” also employs a progressive dance amid lots of repetition and some ridiculousness (“crack an egg with your armpit???”). At the end, can you do all of the dance moves at the same time?
I employ all jazz-oriented musicians for our performances and recordings. Their flexibility, spontaneity and overall musicianship lend themselves perfectly to whatever our audience and participants are bringing to the table. I spent 5 years as a more jazz-oriented player at The University of Kansas in the trombone section of the jazz program while earning my Bachelor’s in Music Education. I’d soon attain a Master’s in Jazz Studies from Chicago’s DePaul University, which gives most of my writing a more jazz/pop backbone.
I also feel like the growing number of activity songs are a response to our post-COVID batch of kids who deserve lots of reasons to move, interact and smile! Let’s grab more opportunities, whether at a show or in your own kitchen, to get away from a screen and interact and create as a young community.
4. Your children, Cameron and Everleigh, contribute vocals to the album, and some of the songs are even inspired by their personalities and favorite foods. What has it been like incorporating your family into the creative process, and how do they influence the music of the Tatar Tots?
This album is all because of Everleigh! When she was 4, I would drive her to day camp in Northbrook IL, where I was also the songleader! We would listen to my 2nd CD “Seconds” on the ride over, and from her carseat she demanded that she wanted another album! She was probably going to get one anyway, but hearing her say it told me that time was right where my own kids were in that magical window of inspiring and appreciating this music. And even my 11 year old son Cameron, who is closer to playing electric guitar on the songs rather than being a willing dance leader, has so much creativity in every direction — I feel like I’d be missing out on a great crossroads in their ages and personalities if there wasn’t album now, or if I didn’t follow their lead in some way! So… they both wanted it and were old enough in their own way to contribute!
Everleigh also directly inspired the ranch dressing song, as our shared love for the tasty condiment serves as a perfect bonding moment. She also sings (semi-reluctantly) the reply “ranch on it” along with her brother. He came to the studio in Chicago to record his part, and she did her part from our basement studio at home.
While Cameron is multi-talented in guitar, bass (acoustic and electric) and tenor sax as a 6th grader, I also had to capture his amazing drawing talents for the cover!! I commissioned him to draw me “weird food people” over a period of time when he was in 5th grade, and he’d get home from school and plop on the floor and draw the most creative and colorful, imaginative creations! He has no idea his talent level! All of his drawings decorate the packaging of this album — I couldn’t be more honored, and love that these talents for his age are frozen in time on the cover. He also helps me out with some tomfoolery in the middle of “Boogie On The Cookie” where he notices something…. funny…. on my cookie. He also helps vocally with some things on “Put A Little Ranch On It” and “Pass It On Down The Line.”
And while her vocal talents don’t appear on the album, I have to credit my amazing wife, without whom none of this would be possible. I still remember when we were dating and attended Lollapalooza together in Chicago. We took a quick detour and checked out the Kidzapalooza stage, and I thought to myself…. I can do this! I do this every day, singing about silly nonsense with my 1st-5th graders, let’s put this act on stage! So none of this would have happened without the kids, but certainly Ilene as well.
5. You’ve spent more than two decades teaching elementary school music while maintaining an active career as a performer, composer, and multi-instrumentalist. How have these two worlds influenced each other, and what have your students taught you about making music engaging, creative, and accessible?
Teaching and performing…. not sure I could easily choose just one, as I am always waiting for the next one to come around. There was a time, maybe 15-20 years ago, where I would teach a full Thursday at Kildeer Countryside School in Long Grove, and then drive home to Chicago’s Wicker Park neighborhood, only to be dressed and ready for a 9pm – 1am jazz/dance set on trombone at the legendary Green Mill Lounge. Once I had said my goodbyes, packed up and actually crawled into my bed at the end of my Thursday evening, I’d have about 2 hours of sleep! It was as if I separated 2 work days with a nap… I am fairly sure I can’t do that anymore. But I think being a frequent performer strengthens my teaching, and as many people in the industry around me say, the students gain from just seeing their teacher musically active. Still being an active performer (sometimes in wedding bands on trombone, or sometimes with “The Tots”) means full immersion and integration, almost a culmination of years of preparation with studying music styles, performers and interpretation. No question, my exposure to even the most fundamental musical concepts at Kildeer Countryside School in Long Grove has made me a more accurate and careful performer, and I think it also just feeds into a big part of my happiness. There’s no ego in the performance for me, although the persona I occasionally put on may lead you to think that way. I’d be happy sitting back in my Trombone 2 chair in a full big band…. the arts create such a balance.
What have my students taught me…. so much! They lead the way very often when it comes to “does this sound good or nah?” They’re a great and honest instant jury, and plenty of times I throw them ideas to get a quick gauge of the cool factor or if an idea works. I know I have a good idea when the students are asking to hear a song again! Although we haven’t recorded it, my band’s song “Colors At The Table,” features a helper to draw colored scarves one at a time out of a bag to decide who dances at a fast part of the song (if you are wearing the color!). We love it because it is different every time we perform it (with different colors coming out or not coming out, or perhaps with people wearing different things!) and it has become a live show staple. The suspense of the song, the instant energy and compelling force to get up and move or be silly has to be a part of it! Everyone needs to have an equal chance to participate in the song, and there’s really no “getting out” in any of the song activities we roll out. Engagement is the top priority at all shows for all ages in the crowd!
As I get older as an artist, I am always looking for ways to make our experience endlessly creative. How can we mix our music with other media? What colors, shapes or objects can we bring in front of the audience to make a memorable moment or performance. Will the entire kids community around me start to take up trombone when they get into 5th grade??? I think of the muse that is “creativitity.” How do we define it or describe it? If we can provide examples of creativity during our performances and inspire people through our songs, themes and expansion on the theme, then we’re doing our job.
6. With three albums now released, including Food!, Seconds, and the upcoming The Kids’ Table, Ben Tatar and the Tatar Tots have built a distinctive musical world for children and families. Looking ahead, what would you still love to explore with the band, and what do you hope children and parents take away from listening to this new album together?
With our band now in existence for about our 12th year, I feel like I am JUST NOW starting to really explore and learn about flexibility within some of the songs we’ve been playing for years. I feel like we are constantly looking at our old songs to mine them for new ideas and ways to interpret them. If money, schedules and logistics (and rehearsals) were not barriers, I would design the Tatar Tots concept where families attending a show could see me with the full band, or perhaps a brass band behind me, or perhaps a string quartet, or a woodwind chamber ensemble playing reed transcriptions of our food songs, or an Argentine quintet with a bandoneon… I would love to reach that level of unpredictability and range, though hanging my hat on that goal isn’t necessary. Our music and shows are best when we are getting fresh passion and interpretations from our songs new and old, and when we can connect with the spontaneous magic that the audience brings us.
I hope kids and parents enjoy this album together. I hope it brings spontaneous joy and natural, personal movement from every listener. Every response from any listener is valid and acceptable. I hope listeners continue to mention to me the parts that stick out to them or the parts they connect with the most. This always helps me to direct our future sons or shows in a similar style. Kids music has to include movement and imagination, so I hope it inspires both in all listeners. I also think our previous 2 albums featured more extensive musical arrangements and styles, and this one is a bit more stripped down: 5 musicians in the door, lots of songs we’ve tested and proven on the road with all audiences… and now it’s time for a greater range of ears to hear them!